Sundtek Has ATSC Enigma 2 Solution

[el bandido]

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Sundtek is a German company that has manufactured a usb ATSC device. I have talked to Sundtek and the confidence that this device will work on the Duo2 is very high. I have been given the option Money Back if the device does not work with the Duo2, providing I return the device. This money back option will also extend to the members of this section.

Sundtek says there may be problems getting the EPG, but does not foresee any scanning or picture problems. Sundtek makes the device, and also writes the drivers, so they more or less have complete control over the device. Sundtek is also taking the novel approach of tricking enigma 2 into think that the ATSC device is actually DVB-T, an approach that I applaud.

Who wants to test this device? I went through the checkout at the website posted above, and the price is a tad under $100.00 U.S. with shipping included. If others are interested in trying or testing his device, then I will invite Sundtek to participate in this forum. Otherwise, I will test it by myself. EB

Note:

Aside of that back to the technical:

When scanning for ATSC:
Select 6 MHz bandwidth in the scanning menu

When scanning for QAM256 or QAM64
select 7 or 8 MHz bandwidth


10867

[eastof111]

There's was an op on the Openpli forum asking why the Sundtek wouldn't blind scan with his duo2. The Suntek rep then posted that they hadn't finished the drivers yet, but would be available sometime in February.

On the 23rd we have to move out for about two months and will lose access to the roof top antenna and sat dishes. But I will order one anyway and see if I can use it in our new temporary location.

[el bandido]

I think Sundtek makes DVB-S2 tuners, and that may have been what was being discussed.
Here is what i was told about ATSC:

as mentioned we just tunnel ATSC through DVB-T (the european standard) and translate the ATSC scanning tables to DVB-T scanning tables so the settopbox really sees a european signal

[el bandido]

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

The tuner in the above link is DVB-S2, and I think that is what the blindscan conversation was about.

[eastof111]

Will be nice if the drivers work on the Duo2 and recognizes the Suntek.

[el bandido]

I have been assured that they will. Or if they do not, then supply the information needed to fix the issue/problem. Look in downloadable plugins and I think you will find something from them already for DVB-T, and since they are making ATSC to look like DVB-T to enigma, then it should work.

A cable usb device was mentioned by Sundtek for North America. I do not have cable or any other pay service at present. Still it may be something to look at in the future.

I am interested in the Sundtek DVB-S2 tuner, maybe for the Zero IF it can be made to blindscan decently.

[eastof111]

The latest ATV has a new plugin for Suntek.

[eastof111]

Placed an order for the tuner today. Their shopping cart website leaves a lot to be desired. Tried placing an order on three different occasions and the site refused to accept it. Sent three e-mails regarding the site problems and never got a response for assistance. Today received an e-mail that my PayPal account had a pending invoice (can't figure out how they got my PayPal account). Also, another e-mail from Sundtek that they processed my order with my address incorrectly displayed. Payed the invoice anyway with a note to correct my address. Let's see what happens next.

Weird way of doing business..... just hope the tuner works correctly when it gets here..

[el bandido]

Will order mine next week....

[ViP3R]

At EB"s request a user name for Sundtek has been created and he now has access to this Private area for support discussions.

Welcome Sundtek!

[Sundtek]

Sorry guys we are just a little bit busy at the moment, we will get back to those things later this week.

[eastof111]

Nice! Received confirmation of shipment today, but the shipping address was not rectified as requested in the Paypal message box. Hopefully, it will arrive without problems. Looking forward to test this tuner.

[el bandido]

Payment Information

Currently we have no delivery method set up for this country.

We are aiming to find a possible delivery method and we will inform you as soon as possible via eMail about the result, including further information about delivery costs.

If you agree to this procedure, please select "move on to next step"


I do not understand this. You are selling a product but do not have shipping to the country the product is intended for?

[el bandido]

Received email saying I wold get PayPal invoice tomorrow. Looks like they are working to make it so we can order without any issues or delays.

[el bandido]

Smooth transaction.
Looks like they will ship to the PayPal address...
Now we wait for shipping.


Payment amount:
(in currency funded) $96.91 USD
Your total charge: $96.91 USD
Conversion rate: 1 USD = 0.8548 EUR
Payment amount:
(in currency received) €82.84 EUR
Sundtek's fees: €3.58 EUR
Sundtek will receive: €79.26 EUR

[eastof111]

Same amount here. I hope they get my delivery address correct.

[el bandido]

Send them email and ask where they sent it maybe?
It looks like they are trying to accommodate our part of the world, but I agree that shipping address part needs work! They do not even ask which state you are in.

If everything works OK here with the ATSC device, then I will probably purchase their DVB-S2 usb and see how it performs. It wold really be nice if they have blindscan for DVB-S2 usb so it can be added to any enigma2 receiver.

[eastof111]

Patience....

[eastof111]

Got my tracking number yesterday......

[el bandido]

February 19, 2015 , 7:56 pm Acceptance GERMANY

Tracking through USPS.
I would guess delivery around the end of this month.

[eastof111]

Hmmmm, tracking mine through Deutsche Post just shows accepted. Using USPS says tracking number not recognized. Well, maybe something will show up soon.

[ViP3R]

Hmmmm, tracking mine through Deutsche Post just shows accepted. Using USPS says tracking number not recognized. Well, maybe something will show up soon.

I would think it will take a while before it show's up in USPS tracking system..Once it's physically in the US it should show up.

[el bandido]

It is supposed to show up in USPS when it gets in their system, regardless of the country the parcel is in.

[ViP3R]

It is supposed to show up in USPS when it gets in their system, regardless of the country the parcel is in.

Well, it didn't..:midfinger2:

[Sundtek]

Hi,

usually foreign countries (as well as Germany when packages come in) re-write the tracking code.

Aside of that back to the technical:

When scanning for ATSC:
Select 6 MHz bandwidth in the scanning menu

When scanning for QAM256 or QAM64
select 7 or 8 MHz bandwidth

Maybe you can add this information to the first page here since this is essential.

We are doing that with a very old ATSC video sample, for sure there's room for improvements but the first step has been done that it works so far.

It would be nice once you have the unit just contact us if you can get us some more current ATSC clips (we are using a very old sample video which I captured in San Francisco a decade ago). The basic support is there but it's still work in progress, we designed the current PCB version on 23rd December 2014.


How to install it

In order to set install the driver on Settopboxes we provide some easy tools for Windows and Mac.
All you need is the ip address and the password (if set) of your settopbox.


[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Documentation:
[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Windows:
[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Mac:
[Only registered and activated users can see links]

This installer is a wrapper will log into the settopbox, download the latest driver and install it.
So even after one year you can still use the same Windows Installer to update the driver.

To update the driver just run the Settopbox Installer again and install the driver again.

Select DVB-T when installing it

By experience this installer works with all images out there.

[el bandido]

Thanks for the information.
Only a few people can see this section. The idea is to get the devices working here, then post detailed instructions in the main forums.
For OpenPLi, Openvix, or other enigma2, what do we need to do? Is there a plugin we should download?

[Sundtek]

it's all the same, just use the installer. It will reboot your system afterwards and you should see the tuner inside the tuner configuration menu

You might be able to use some additional features in the Sundtek Control Center

For example the tuners can also be used via Network

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

This is not tested yet with Settopboxes and ATSC, however I'm sure we'll go over that within the next days as well.

eg. you might connect the tuner to a router or Raspberry PI (which supports Linux) with USB and stream it to the Settopbox across your apartment.
You can do that with ClearQAM / ATSC.

We can take care about the translation as well of course once the basic things are all confirmed.

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

(this was just done with VTI because it was installed, but any image will work)

[eastof111]

Hi Sundtek looking forward to trying out the tuner. Quick question. What's the difference between the Windows installer vs. the control center plugin in post #7?

[Sundtek]

Sundtek Controlcenter is for configuring the driver (it can also install the driver, but somehow you need to install the controlcenter :-) Some images already have the Sundtek Controlcenter in the plugin list some don't.

We don't want to explain every customer how to install it on a particular image so we built our own installer around it which just works with every image.
The Windows/Mac installer just logs into your settopbox downloads the latest drivers, the latest controlcenter and installs it.
Afterwards you can play with the Controlcenter.

[eastof111]

I was playing by happenstance with ATV and noticed the plugin the other day and installed it just to see what it looked like.

Thanks appreciate it.

[Sundtek]

You can install it of course if it available, also the plugin will download the latest driver.

[eastof111]

Good to know. When I receive the tuner I will play with the plugin first and see what happens. If negative, I'll uninstall and use the Windows version.


It will be a pleasure having ATSC in one box again like my very old Sonicview STB.

Thanks again.

[el bandido]

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

The above link contains an impressive list of drivers and plugins. OpenPLi does not have the Sundtek plugin in their feeds, so I installed the latest .ipk file listed in the link. Will try to post this plugin in the E2 section later.

[el bandido]

February 22, 2015 , 11:14 pm Processed Through Sort Facility FRANKFURT/FLUGHAFEN, GERMANY

February 19, 2015 , 7:56 pm Acceptance GERMANY


(Tracking through USPS)

[eastof111]

Tracking USPS

[el bandido]

You might have yours by the end of the week, depending on how long customs keeps it.

[eastof111]

Unless they decide to test it first. LOL.

[Sundtek]

Some screenshots of the current status:

Channelselection
[Only registered and activated users can see links]

ATSC Scanning (yes it can find the channel names! since we are editing the received stream and translating it to DVB-T!):
[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Watching ATSC:
[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[el bandido]

For those that want to know, WXIA is channel 11 in Atlanta, Ga. What is shown is being displayed and presented correctly.

I plan to test the ATSC device on all of my receivers that are capable of supporting it. The results along with screenshots will be posted in the open forums for all to see and enjoy.

[eastof111]

Looking forward to doing a comparison to the old Sonicview in regards to scan times, total scans, sensitivity, etc. Regardless, it will be a nice addition to the Duo2. Will also try it with the Optibox Raptor.

[Sundtek]

WXIA-TV (1920x1080)
[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[eastof111]

Nice image.

[el bandido]

It would be even nicer if the EPG could be made to populate. Still a big improvement over what we had previously, which was nothing!
I applaud the efforts of Sundtek!

[Sundtek]

We can put EPG and Closed Captioning onto the wishlist for next month.

Aside of that the channel scan will depend on a terrestrial.xml file - or you have to enter all the frequencies manually one by one, but we can also make that userfriendly next month (eg. implement a small scanning tool for Windows that generates that XML file for you).

The chance is high that all that will really be done because we have some business customers also asking for those things (except the settopbox support, that was your request)

[el bandido]

Where is the terrestrial .xml file in the file system??? I guess I can hunt for its location if needed.

[Sundtek]

I guess none exists for it because no one ever used ATSC with E2 and your location - you're the first one.

You might need to create one by yourself

it looks like this (now I don't know what bandwidth="0" means, for ATSC you must set it to 6 MHz otherwise it will scan QAM channels:

I don't know what bndwidth="0" means, maybe it's 6 MHz because with normal Linux systems it translates 0,1,2 -> 6,7,8MHz

<terrestrial name="Iceland (IS): DVB-T Frequencies" flags="5">
<transponder centre_frequency="177500000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="184500000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="191500000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="198500000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="205500000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="212500000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="219500000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="234000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="226500000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="242000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="250000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="258000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="266000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="274000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="282000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="290000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="298000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="306000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="314000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="322000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="330000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="338000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="346000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="354000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="362000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="370000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="378000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="386000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="394000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="402000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="410000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="418000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="426000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="434000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="442000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="450000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="458000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="474000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="482000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="522000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="530000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="682000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="690000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="698000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="706000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="714000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="722000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="730000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="738000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="754000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="762000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="770000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="778000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="794000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="802000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
<transponder centre_frequency="818000000" bandwidth="0" constellation="3"/>
</terrestrial>

[el bandido]

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

There is a BlackHole ATSC E2 Image that scans and does everything except show a picture. I will dig the .xml file out of it, but it will probably be the same .xml file that I posted some time ago at OpenPLi.

Just cannot remember where that file resides in E2. Will try and look this evening.

[Sundtek]

I just think they deployed a terrestrial.xml (or something similar by themselves) - without it it will not do anything.

But I'm sure we cannot compete with the WAF (Wife acceptance factor) with the blackhole image,

> my dear let's watch 551 SID 1 tonight
> sure let me zap through it

;-)

unfortunately you have to tell the channel name with our Tuners

[eastof111]

In my current OpenATV the terrestrial.xml file is in /etc and /usr/share. Here what ATV's looks like.

[Sundtek]

The bandwidth should be "2" then, you might modify the file.

for mid term we can implement some real auto scan and possibly a lineup server to submit the channel list to us so everyone can download and re-use it.

[eastof111]

Anyone have a current list of U.S. frequencies for channels 2 through 70? I thought I had saved my list when I was playing with the Hypercube stb, but I guess I misplaced it.

[eastof111]

Found it....

[el bandido]

February 24, 2015 , 10:11 am Processed Through Sort Facility ISC NEW YORK NY(USPS)

Inbound, U.S. Customs. Would expect the device to be here Monday at the latest, depending on how slow Customs is operating.

[eastof111]

They're still testing mine. LOL

[el bandido]

Now outbound from Customs. (I called and told them they could keep your device if they would release mine.)

February 25, 2015 , 10:21 am Arrived at USPS Facility KEARNY, NJ 07032

Should be here Friday with Monday being the latest.

[eastof111]

Looks like they're still testing it. lol.

[eastof111]

Mine left Garden City, NJ last night via the scenic route

[el bandido]

February 26, 2015 , 2:43 am Departed USPS Facility KEARNY, NJ 07032

Maybe Tomorrow, but looks like definitely by Saturday for me. Kearny, NJ is about 14 hours ground travel time to Atlanta, Ga.

[eastof111]

Yeah, but not if it's snowing... lol.

[el bandido]

The snow....is Gone!

[el bandido]

February 26, 2015 , 9:57 pm Arrived at USPS Facility ATLANTA, GA 30369

I must say There has been a tremendous amount of interest in Atlanta weather lately. Even Berlin has noticed!

My device will be here tomorrow, unless something unexpected happens.

[Sundtek]

Did the unit arrive?

[el bandido]

Tracking Status is "Out for Delivery". I am working today, but will check and see about 3 hours from now. I see no reason why it should not be delivered later today.

[mb1]

Did the unit arrive?

Sundtek

Can you enable Canada on online store..I email already my info


Thanks

[el bandido]

Have the device installed and drivers updated to 2-24-2015. The scan is not working. Probably need to change the scan table???
Working on getting channels at present.

I will start thread in the open forums once the device is receiving tv channels. Let's debug it here first.

[eastof111]

Still waiting for mine to arrive.... think it took a detour in Jersey.

[el bandido]

The East Coast has an advantage with shipping from Germany.

The Device works, but not on OpenPLi. Will scan a few more channels, look for bugs, then post an update.

Overall, very impressive! No crashes or anything bad yet. Looks like a real solid device that we can be proud of! Support from Sundtek has been excellent!

[eastof111]

Which image works?

[el bandido]

Black Hole and Viti are the only two working for the Duo2. Black Hole works the best. This device is still being developed, and look forward to you joining us.

I am the first person to test the Sundtek ATSC device in North America.

[el bandido]

Sundtek is updating as fast as I can test.

Add OpenVix to the list of working images. That last update sent to me a few minutes ago probably fixed almost all images for Duo2.
Will branch out and test other boxes as time permits. Excellent support!

[el bandido]

Scan is working...Need to check and make sure all available frequencies are in the table.
10975

[Sundtek]

The terrestrial scanfile which includes ATSC frequencies:

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[eastof111]

Scan is working...Need to check and make sure all available frequencies are in the table.
10975
Did the scan include sub-channels?


Mine is sightseeing in Denver, hopefully it will arrive Monday or Tuesday the latest.

[el bandido]

Yes. Sub-channels are working, but currently listed with the call letters of the station and sub-stations. Excellent work!

[Sundtek]

The Settopbox Installer is also updated, you can select ATSC now for installing the driver:

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[eastof111]

Anxious to try mine out whenever it arrives. Will this driver support recording to hdd or usb?

[eastof111]

Played some more with the ATV plugin I installed two weeks ago and it is the same version as the one Windows installs. I selected the tuner and it connected to the Sundtek server and it installed the latest driver, so hopefully it should be plug and play when the tuner arrives.

[Sundtek]

you can record to hdd or usb yes.

Aside of that:
* Windows drivers are currently in progress (they're like 95% done)
* Linux and MacOSX drivers are already available

Once the driver stuff is ready we'll work on an application for it for those systems. Please note the device is just around 2 months old at the moment and we are still working on it.

You can install the driver via the Sundtek control center (if available already) or through the Windows App, both will result in having the latest driver on the box. We have a good generic driver installer which works like that for years already.

[el bandido]

Nothing short of spectacular support from Sundtek!

You will not have anything to do East, except to download and install ATSC file in etc/enigma2.
ALL tuner options are available to the ATSC device including timeshift and record.

Will have thread in the DVB tuner section in a few minutes to answer more questions.

[el bandido]

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Please post any questions in the thread listed above unless it is something that should be said in this private area. The tough part is done. The device works!

[eastof111]

Very Nice! Vu+ you might learn a lesson or two in consumer support if you read and answered your emails. I think I will repeat this message when it goes public in a few other forums too.

[el bandido]

I am not going to try and defend VU because there is no defense.

But my discussions with Sundtek lead me to think that the real problem lies in the driver of the device and not in the driver of the box.
Granted, box drivers are very very important, but there will never be an ATSC usb device from anybody else that works on e2 Unless their drivers are optimized for it.


This is what I call the Chicken and the egg effect:
Vu has no control over WinTV drivers, and WinTV has no control over VU drivers. So the ATSC device BlackHole has worked on for years will never work in VU...Not unless WinTV fixes their driver to run with E2. Just My Opinion.

[eastof111]

Hmmmmmm...... we could go in circles arguing the point, but if Sundtek decides to issue a tuner for the N.A. fta market that does blind scan equal to an X2 in speed and accuracy, I would buy four to replace my current vu+ tuners. Nuff said.

[Sundtek]

We have an S2 device that is not the problem, however for the US / CA Market we would prefer to go with the second or third revision of our Tuner (the third one would be with UHD support, it's cooking in the mind of our HW engineer the release of the third rev is unknown at the moment).
Since America is really far away we would like to minimize any potential issue with Hardware.
We have had some issues with the first revision that they were not able to power all kind of energy hungry LNBs, the second revision will address this issue. Even though only 1% of our customers were affected by it this is something that had to be sorted out on our side.

Our big advantage is that the entire company is owned and controlled by engineers. So whoever you get on the line at our side they know about every detail of the device; They can even give you the first name of every resistor on the boards ;-)

I'm sure we can come up with something that is well suited for the north american market within the next few weeks.

[eastof111]

Testing new ideas ....... that's the name of the game. When something is formulated that works and is feasible to support a market segment, go for it. I am always willing to test new ideas.

[eastof111]

I am running into a slight problem. When tuning in a weak channel that does not lock in, the tuner tries to lock in the station without allowing me to go on to another channel. The only way out of this loop situation is to putty and do a reboot.

[el bandido]

Trust me, it used to be a lot worse, but I see the driver probably needs more work in that area.

I had a lock-up on Channel 2 tonight. What caused mine was changing from from a weak channel to an empty satellite channel. Channel 2 was glitching, probably from signal loss but was showing about 80 percent on the signal bar. Do not know if the lock-up was from channel 2 glitching, or if it was from changing to a blank fta channel.

Any more information you can give would be nice and might help resolve the issues. There shows a driver update, and I am curious if you installed it. Look at the plugin and if there is an update, it will be shown at the top right corner of the plugin screen.

Curious to know how your channel names scanned in, and if all names scanned correctly. Curious to know if any channel scanned a "Unknown", and if so, does the "unknown" channel work?

[eastof111]

I loaded the latest driver this afternoon prior to scanning. When mine goes into a loop the keys on the RC stop working requiring a reboot.

Here's some pictures of my scan after I uploaded to Dreamboxedit.

[el bandido]

I think Sundtek put in at least 20 hours with me over the weekend, and no telling how much more time was spent that I do not know about.
You do not have any channels listed as unknown, which is good. But you are having the same lock-up problem I was having. At first, I could not scan without it locking up. I thought it was completely fixed, but apparently not.

Which channel(s) in that list give problems? Can you use the remote and scroll through the channels without it locking? On the scan, did you get everything that the tv would get with a scan? How does the sensitivity of the device compare with the sensitivity of the tv?

[Sundtek]

114 - 121 look suspicious, contact us via Skype (sundtek) to see what's going on if you have a problem.

We'd give you a debug version of the driver showing us which line in the code the crash happens.
I think it should be a fairly easy thing to track that now.

[el bandido]

The number problem for the channel names seems to be only at the higher end of the band, after 500MHz?

11029

[Sundtek]

You can see that the picture is not ok - so the signal is not good enough at those frequencies, however I would have to check the stream as well.

[eastof111]

114-121 are channels that work. I don't remember which ones were giving me problems. Tomorrow will restore a settings backup and start all over again installing the driver, etc., and do a new scan. I will pay more attention to the problematic ones and keep notes to post.

As I mentioned earlier, I can't use the remote to scroll up or down because the RC does not respond.

I am missing some channels but that could be the station. Will have to check that further.

I also get pixelization on some strong signal channels. I can see that happening on weak signal channels but it should be doing that on very strong signals.

[Sundtek]

just adjust the antenna a little bit, the signal strength is so so; the BER is what counts.

if 114-121 work just contact us via Skype to get a transponder dump from that frequency.

The most important part is the antenna, if you have a weak signal you can definitely improve that by getting some better Antenna.

With something like a yagi antenna you will definitely not get a bad picture - but something in between the normal one and yagi should definitely do the trick.

it has to be balanced - the tuner can only be as good as the antenna is.

ATSC is terrestrial the signal is not always the same there are gaps in between from time to time so you need to see that you can catch most of the signal. If there's a channel with doubtful sensitivity a better antenna will definitely help.

[Sundtek]

One more feature, aside of that if you think ATSC has a bad signal where your TV system is sitting, you can also use the device via network.

You would require a Raspberry PI and connect it via ethernet to your home network. You can deploy the RPI and tuner wherever you want in your home and just stream ATSC safely to your Settopbox.

This is a driver feature, the network support can be configured on the settopbox using the sundtek controlcenter.

on the raspberry PI you would have to enable the server:
[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[chewie]

Hello Guys
What are you guys using for antenna with this tuner?
please let me know.
Regards.
Chewie

[Sundtek]

Hello Guys
What are you guys using for antenna with this tuner?
please let me know.
Regards.
Chewie

We use the standard antenna in Berlin with our DVB-T tuners, but we also see that the picture will be bad eg. if you walk with the tuner or put it into a corner where the signal is worse.
ATSC is just similar, you need to adjust the antenna to a position which is able to catch most of the signal.
In General I would say the bigger the better, if you have a doubtful signal try to visit a TV store in your area and have a closer look at what is available (or possibly Amazon).

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

this one for sure is a good one.

[el bandido]

Antenna number 1,
I have the biggest beam antenna that you can buy without going commercial. This antenna is a log periodic design for VHF, UHF FM, and is mounted to a rotor on a 15 meter tower.

Antenna Number 2,
The biggest beam antenna that you can buy for UHF without going commercial. This antenna is mounted to the side of the tower at around 10 meters up on the tower, and is poorly mounted in a fixed location. I need to do somw mounting work to this antenna.

[el bandido]

Attached is a picture of my tv antenna system. There is also a decent wifi antenna on the tower.

Also attached are some pictures of weak channels displaying a bit error rate. Looks like a memory leak may still be an issue because the slow E2 spinner is active when the weak or lost station is resolved.

The beam antenna has been moved this morning, causing some loss of signals on some stations, and distorted pictures on others. I am still able to change or scroll through the entire channel list, but it is tedious or difficult on blank or weak stations. The spinner is active at these difficult times,buti can break the lockup when the spinner briefly stops.

Looks like a total lockup only happens when the signal continuously jumps above/below the reception threshold.
The receiver locked totally at bed time last night, but it recovered with a single remote button push this AM. I am pretty sure the signal that the box locked on was also stronger this AM.

[eastof111]

just adjust the antenna a little bit, the signal strength is so so; the BER is what counts.

if 114-121 work just contact us via Skype to get a transponder dump from that frequency.

The most important part is the antenna, if you have a weak signal you can definitely improve that by getting some better Antenna.

With something like a yagi antenna you will definitely not get a bad picture - but something in between the normal one and yagi should definitely do the trick.

it has to be balanced - the tuner can only be as good as the antenna is.

ATSC is terrestrial the signal is not always the same there are gaps in between from time to time so you need to see that you can catch most of the signal. If there's a channel with doubtful sensitivity a better antenna will definitely help.

I use a roof top VHF-UHF-FM Yagi made by Winegard mounted on a rotor. Aiming the antenna towards the transmitting tower to increase the already strong signal makes no difference. It will still pixelate occasionally or randomly no matter how strong the signal.

[el bandido]

What amount of signal strength is being displayed on the channels that pixelate?

[eastof111]

Example.... the DT station for Fox 10 is at 82% and pixelates. The Fox 10 SD channel is at 13% and does not pixelate.

[el bandido]

I have seen some slight pixelation at times on my HD channels that show around 80 percent signal.
Which band does your antenna favor? VHF or UHF?

Your bit error rate is high for the channel that pixelates. and is 0 on the stronger channel. I suspect the Fox 10 station is really at 113 percent. I think the display only allows for two digits. My WXIA will display 0 or 1 sometimes for a signal strength, then at other times, it will be in the 90's. So I figure it is going over the top and 0 is actually 100.

HD pictures require more information to process, so you need a stronger signal to have a crystal clear HD picture. Any millisecond interruption in the HD transmission stream will cause picture problems, whereas millisecond interruptions in SD are not as noticeable, and may not be seen.

[chewie]

Man, I just routed my Roof top antenna to another room and I get many channels, Most likely I going to have to use a splitter.
Just order my tuner 2 days ago it should ship out today I was told. I am going to try it on my new MIraclebox when it gets here, it was ship out on the 2/17/15 and still no signs on the USPS yet, I wonder if the bad weather has something to do with it.
Regards.
Chewie.

[el bandido]

It took about 10 days for mine to arrive. I would expect the West Coast to be around 14 days.
Soon, You should receive a tracking number that will work with USPS tracking after a couple more days.
I have made or am trying to make another purchase, but it does not seem like anybody is at home? Maybe Sundtek can wake SALES up for us???

[eastof111]

I have no problems with these channels on my older Mitsubishi monitor.

[eastof111]

"I wonder if the bad weather has something to do with it." Probably.... The trip from Germany to the east coast is fast, but once it hits customs it's a lethargic process. The box I received wasn't even opened, but it was most likely x-rayed. Then they sent it to Denver for some reason. But it arrived in one piece and didn't get lost.

[el bandido]

The older monitor may not require as much information to process the signal? It is the downside of terrestrial HD.

[eastof111]

Could be, but sometimes older is better.... LOL.

[el bandido]

You had to say that in front of EC...

[Sundtek]

Did you try to use the antenna of your TV?

However please contact us via Skype Chat (sundtek) in order to sort out your lock up issue. The driver does not really crash your system. connecting using telnet and running following commands will just re-start enigma2. When the tuner disappears, Enigma2 locks up because it has no hotplug support.



init 4
init 3


We only manufactured around 150 units whereas most of them went to our business customer who is shipping his products to US. The USB ports and antenna connectors still need to be soldered, that's why it takes 2-3 days before we can acknowledge and ship out the devices. They are not completely assembled in stock.

The DVB-S/S2 and ATSC signal strength is not related with each other, each different chip (even with DVB-S/S2) has its own scale.

[el bandido]

Thanks for the information.
The terrain that is around me would make the indoor antenna useless, that explains the reason for the tower and antennas. Indoor antenna used to work when the signal was analog.
I am making some changes to my antenna system, which should give me more channels in a single scan. The lock-up cannot be easily produced for my system, so give me a bit more time to gather some information as to how to reliably re-create it. I will try to have information tomorrow around this time,[
and will have the viewer set back up if needed.

[Sundtek]

We only need to deploy a debug driver of the latest version, once it happens it should create a memory dump so no need to watch it permanently from our side.

[el bandido]

East, Can you get the receiver to lockup now???

[eastof111]

No, after I restored a backup and started from scratch it hasn't looped or locked up for me so far. Still using the 2015-03-01 18:55:06 driver.

I did do a new automatic scan and it found 50 channels. Did the same with my Mitsubishi and it found 60 channels. Did a manual complete scan and it found four more channels. So, I am missing six channels.

Will play some more with scanning and see what I find.

[Sundtek]

Please note you are only scanning the frequencies inside the frequency list, if something is missing in the list or off a bit you will not catch it up.

Try to figure out which stations are missing and try to figure out the frequencies of the missing channels from your TV set, possibly you only have to edit the terrestrial.xml file and add the frequency.

[eastof111]

That was going to be my next project. Have to go to the dot gov website and figure out the frequencies for the missing channels and then add them to the xml file. Time permitting will do it this week.

[el bandido]

Which dot gov site has this information?

[el bandido]

I left my receiver on a very weak channel last night, and found it locked up, or looped this morning. A logging device designed to capture information about this problem was installed, so maybe Sundtek will have the information needed to fix it.
It is hard for me to get this system to lock or freeze like this, and it is something I could live with, but I think everybody involved wants it fixed!

[el bandido]

I get a weak signal from Alabama, received from the back of the beam antenna at 177MHz. Funny that the scan finds it at 177MHz, then when the scan is complete, the correct station id of WCIQ (7.1) is displayed.

11040 11041

[el bandido]

I have a hard time leaving a channel that has a weak or no signal.
The spinner will become active, and the receiver freezes until the spinner stops. The spinner will only stop for a short time on these channels, then it will resume. So you have to time your exit. A lot of patience is needed if there is a three or four channel mux that has no signal and you try to channel up/down through the list of tv channels.

11044

[Sundtek]

I get a weak signal from Alabama, received from the back of the beam antenna at 177MHz. Funny that the scan finds it at 177MHz, then when the scan is complete, the correct station id of WCIQ (7.1) is displayed.

11040 11041

I am not sure about that if we can do anything... I need to think a little bit further about that first.
This is a complicated area where 2 ATSC tables need to be merged to one DVB-T packet.

[el bandido]

Really could care less how it gets scanned in, just would like it to display just like the tv, which the 177Mhz channel does. Thought it was interesting to see it scan like that, 177MHz WCIQ is a weak/distorted signal since it is being received on the backside of the beam, and at a good distance for terrestrial signal.

[eastof111]

Which dot gov site has this information?

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Scroll down to bottom of page and highlight TV Query (Detailed Output) and it will display more info including frequency of station.

[eastof111]

I have a hard time leaving a channel that has a weak or no signal.
The spinner will become active, and the receiver freezes until the spinner stops. The spinner will only stop for a short time on these channels, then it will resume. So you have to time your exit. A lot of patience is needed if there is a three or four channel mux that has no signal and you try to channel up/down through the list of tv channels.

11044

That's exactly what was happening with mine. But for some reason it has stopped looping, it just takes a longer time to lock in a station.
But at least it doesn't loop.

[Sundtek]

so it did not crash or lock up just hang that way?

I know what is going on when this happens.

it is checking for a signal lock 10 times in the background and returns to engima2. I will put this onto the list for the next 1-2 days to evaluate this process again.

[el bandido]

I should have a crash dump for you I am in/out right now.

[eastof111]

Hmmmm..... just turned on the receiver and certain channels that were working fine yesterday are stuck in the search or lock in loop. These same channels are high strength in signal. Switch over to my Mitsubishi and the same channels display fine.

[el bandido]

Did you try rebooting the box using the rocker switch on back?

[eastof111]

Yes, still the same. Will shut it off later and let it sit over night and see what happens tomorrow.

[eastof111]

This is another station that was coming in great yesterday but not today as it is pixelating. Basically the same signal strength.

Edit:

Forgot to mention that I compared it to the Mitsubishi and reception there is no problem. I also tried fine tuning the antenna aim with the rotor and the signal level was at its peak.

[el bandido]

Are you feeding the receiver and the tv off the same antenna and using separate cables for each? How many elements does your VHF antenna have?

I find signal strength does not matter as much as the Bit Error Rate. The BER can be high for different reasons, including cabling and connectors.

The feed of my antenna system is being updated. I went from getting 20 something channels in a scan, up to 67 channels in a single scan.

As a test, I did a scan with the Zero and got 62 channels. The antenna coax was immediately moved from the Zero to the tv, and the tv scanned 69 channels. I noticed at least 2 of the channels the tv found were analog, and I wonder if analog channels are being scanned as unknown in the Sundtek device???

Next test was to scroll through the channels to verify that they all worked. I found a 15 channel mux that the tv had scanned, but none of the channels were strong enough to produce picture or sound on the tv.
After seeing this dead mux, I immediately removed the antenna from the tv and installed it back in the Zero. The 15 channel mux that was dead on the tv worked on the Zero.

So my tv finds more, but I seem to watch more on the Vu+.

I also noted that the tv finds all the channel names, instead of finding some in frequencies. This is only eye candy but maybe adjustments can be made in this area at some point to allow the Sudtek device to find all names, even if the signal is weak.

Another area of concern for me is my cabling. I am feeding two tvs right now off the same input cable. The input cable is cheap RG6, and is around 25-30 meters in length. The input cable stops at an amplified splitter and then ran to the two separate locations.
I notice that I am losing signal at the input cable around 500 MHz and up at an unacceptable level. That cheap coax is fine for short runs of 30-50 meters in a satellite installation, but it is a poor choice for a terrestrial tv system with little or no line amplification that is operating over 500 MHz.
My solution to ease the signal loss above 500 MHz to an acceptable level will be to cut out about 20-25 meters of the input cable and replace it with RG11. Doing this should let me gain at least 3db in non-amplified signal. I should notice a difference in the signal strength at the higher frequencies after doing this.

A satellite system has 40-60 db of built in line amplification, so you can run crap coax for a long distance and get away with it.
But a tv system does not usually have a line amp installed at the antenna, and the tv amplifiers are usually not anywhere near that strong so fine details to the cabling is a must!

[eastof111]

My antenna was feeding my Sonicview and Mitsubishi via an antenna amplifier mounted at the antenna mast with the ps inside the house located behind the tv. The ps has a three way splitter built in which I used to send the signal to the Mitsu and Sonicview. Since we are in the process of remodeling the house, I have had to pack up all fta equipment except the Vu+, DTV and Mitsubishi tv. In another week I probably won't have access to anything for a week or more. In the interim the Mitsu is still connected along with the Vu+ and Sundtek via the same splitter connections.

But to reiterate, the Sonicview and Mitsu both received the same amount of channels without pixelation for the past five years or so. I never found a need to upgrade to RG11 from RG6 because the signal received was more than adequate for both the Mitsu and Sonicview. No complaints there. Prior to going fully digital, I was able to receive four or five Tucson channels on both the Mitsu and Sonicview by aiming the antenna in that direction, almost 110 miles away. But no more due after the FCC switch.

Anyway, will keep testing as long as I can and see what happens.

[el bandido]

The BER on that channel is high. Maybe look for ways to lower it and not worry about signal strength.

RG11 Is not the solution for everybody, but it has considerable less loss per hundred ft. than crap RG6. Solid copper RG6 does not do bad, but most will not pay the 2-3 dollars a foot that solid copper/solid copper sheild RG6 costs.

For your channel sparkles and tears, let's look at something else.


NOTE: ATSC signal centered 310 KHz above lower edge.

Save your file, then download and install this ATSC file. Then delete all channels and rescan. You may want to backup first for easy restore.

Rescanning with the attached file added stability to some channels that were having some picture issues in my system. Much improved for me. Added 13 frequencies to the top end of this file.

[el bandido]

I find the overall performance has greatly improved since adding 310KHz to the center frequencies. Overall stability has increased, and some channels that were having slight picture problems have greatly improved. (More observation time is needed.)

gain, I let the receiver sit overnight on a weak channel. In the AM, the receiver was not locked up, but had to hard boot the receiver to get ATSC signals again. Init 4 & Init 3 would not return the channels. This test was done with a new channel scan using the file in previous post. So it looks like adding 310KHz made a noticeable difference.

My only two concerns now are,

(1) Receiver will not display channels after sitting on a channel with little or no signal. it takes a hard boot to return signal.

(2) It takes a lot of patience to leave a channel that has No Signal. The spinner becomes active on these channels, and you have to base your exit from these channels on the spinner disappearing briefly. Looks like the memory is getting ate up on channels without signal.

[eastof111]

I'll give it a try later and see what happens... why did you pick 310?

[el bandido]

quote from posts above....

NOTE: ATSC signal centered 310 KHz above lower edge.

[eastof111]

Tried the file and managed to pickup three new channels. Still having pixelation problems with the same channels I mentioned yesterday.

Seems the signal level on the main digital channels have to be over 88% in order to lock without BER problems and not have pixelation. With the exception of channel 3.1 which displays 3% with no BER problems nor pixelation. The ABC channel is smoking at 98%. The FOX sd channel that I posted yesterday still comes in at 13% and no BER errors.

[el bandido]

Here are three pictures of a channel that is very similar in frequency and channel content to one of your problem channels, but working without any issues.

These pictures were taken using the UHF antenna which is seriously compromised when used on a VHF signal.
Normal signal strength on this channel is usually between 3 and 15, which is really 103 and 115. The signal meter needs to be adjusted down about 25-30 points so the stronger stations will not be over 99 in strength.

[el bandido]

Man, I just routed my Roof top antenna to another room and I get many channels, Most likely I going to have to use a splitter.
Just order my tuner 2 days ago it should ship out today I was told. I am going to try it on my new MIraclebox when it gets here, it was ship out on the 2/17/15 and still no signs on the USPS yet, I wonder if the bad weather has something to do with it.
Regards.
Chewie.


Any updates on your shipping status???

[chewie]

not yet, i been e-mailing them but no answer, this is for the tuner, regarding my miraclebox they think it may go lost they are looking into it.
Regards.
Chewie

[el bandido]

Sundtek never answered my email or completed my order for a second tuner. Customer service needs to be a lot better.

[eastof111]

Due to packing things for remodeling, I couldn't find my usb cable for the camera. So, I couldn't post a pix of the antenna I am using. Finally found it and here's the pix of the Winegard that I have been using for more than ten years. Prior to digitalization by the FCC, I had no problems viewing stations about 110 miles away. My location being at almost 2000 feet has definitely helped.

[Sundtek]

Things are very busy here sorry. It's not like things are on the shelf ready for shipping this project especially for Settopboxes still needs some R&D etc.

Regarding the outstanding ATSC orders they will be shipped by today.

Regarding the open ATSC issues I hope they will be bailed out within this week we've seen some critical issues in the ATSC->DVB-T rewriting logic which are indeed able to crash the driver.
Around 3 issues are solved with the latest driver more could not be found within the testing period so far - just update to the driver version of today.

[el bandido]

We appreciate the work and support. I realize ATSC is a start-up project, but some sort of email or other communication about the status of an order would be nice. I tried to order a second stick a week ago, and never got any kind of acknowledgement or request for payment about it. At this point, I have no idea if I need to reorder or just wait for a reply or bill.

[Sundtek]

We appreciate the work and support. I realize ATSC is a start-up project, but some sort of email or other communication about the status of an order would be nice. I tried to order a second stick a week ago, and never got any kind of acknowledgement or request for payment about it. At this point, I have no idea if I need to reorder or just wait for a reply or bill.

I fully agree with that, however we are really too busy at the moment; we're upgrading all our european devices at the moment.
The driver is up to date now, I hope all the obvious issues are solved now.

I try to squeeze in ATSC whenever I can (we have a very tough schedule at the moment).
So if you have some feedback just write it here and I will pick it up as soon as possible.

[el bandido]

Where can the new driver be downloaded? Online with the plugin?

I think we are going to need more feedback from other users with other systems before much more can be done.
However, I have a similar issue(s) as East with a couple of channels that want to glitch when the signal is strong, and the BER is at zero. This glitching appears to be an amplified problem, or front end overload. I say this because (1) The channel plays fine on the tv with/without the line amplifier installed and (2) The channel plays fine with the Sundtek device IF it is on another antenna that has no line amplification. Could the line amp be overloading the Sundtek device and not the tv???

East has a high BER which I could contribute to the glitching but my issues are with the BER at 0 I moved the center frequency a bit, ranging from 180 KHz to 310KHz, and this seemed to help, but I think it was more conditions than moving the center frequency. The glitching is not constant, and sometimes I have a clear picture, even with the line amplifier running. Is it possible to show the SNR in db instead of giving a percentage reading that goes up when an amplifier is installed??? Also adjusted the percentage signal strength down because it is going over 99 and reading very low when doing this. My strongest channel reads 20 percent when the line amplifier is running, so it would help if the signal meter could be pulled down or scaled down at least 25 points.

I made a heat comparison test using the Sundtek ATSC and a WinTV 850 fro Hauppauge. The device temperature was not measured, but the Sundtek usb device runs noticeably cooler than the WinTv usb in my system.

[Sundtek]

You can either use the sundtek controlcenter or the settopbox installer to update the driver, I guess most settopbox users will just use the control center for this.
The installation and/or update instruction will always stay the same (it has been the same for several years already).

Amplifiers always have been some issues in the past, depending on the amplifier some do not only amplify the signal but also the noise around it. We did not add many filters infront of the tuner chip leaving this end open, so it will depend on the filter/amp which you put infront of the tuner if both will match.

I put the SNR onto the list for the next update I just checked it and yes it's possible to add this.

Our Harware-Engineer spent quite some time to play around with the power management.

The Windows driver is almost ready as well, but I guess the first working version will be released within next week.

[el bandido]

I will be glad to test the windows system when it is ready.

[chewie]

I finally got a tracking number for my order today, my order is shipping from Denmark, I tough this company is in Germany, did your orders shipped from Germany?
Regards.
Chewie

[el bandido]

Yes, from Germany. Are you sure that it is not a tracking number for your Miraclebox?? Anyway, I would not be too concerned about the Country as long as it arrives and works.

[Sundtek]

Deutschland is the German word for Germany. I guess you mistake it with Denmark.

[el bandido]

I will check the new driver for crashes.
It seems my biggest issue now is trying to leave a channel that has no signal. The spinner becomes active and the receiver freezes on any channel without a signal, so you have to be very patient and time your exit from these channels. It can be frustrating.

[Sundtek]

I think we can lower the retry timeout from 10 to 5 to improve this a little bit.
We really don't want anything to happen asynchronously in our software especially since it might add an undefined behaviors to various chipsets.

[el bandido]

Try moving it and I will be glad to test it.

Adding additional receivers like the SH4 and AzBox would be nice, as time and resources permit.

Scan time of the Sundtek device and the WinTv device are about even. My tv scans faster, but those guys have had a lot of time to adjust and optimize their equipment.

[Sundtek]

Those settopboxes use the sledgehammer for scanning DVB-T transponders, indeed that is absolutely not optimized in Enigma2.

I guess it should be possible to do it faster with the tuners.

Just to compare, digital cable in Germany takes around 20 Minutes to scan with normal linux tools, however we are able to complete a full scan below 5 minutes with optimized tools. Software is the key for that.

The scanning has no priority at the moment I'm moreover thinking about the EPG to support that one, it's a little bit boring without knowing what's on.

[eastof111]

The 03-10-2015 driver loaded automatically when I turned on my receiver today. One of the stations 10.1 which I was having glitch problems with in my earlier posts, seems to have improved. The BER is much lower for some reason, even though I have not touched the antenna position, nor made any other changes.

The search loop is still acting the same. But I am happy that the BER has dropped..... makes a big difference in the glitching department.

[Sundtek]

I recommend to not use the auto update, it's not useful anymore we have many different devices out there and not every update will affect your device.

The old driver indeed was able to damage the videostream in the worst case due ATSC table parser issues, those have been addressed with the last update.
But the BER I don't think nor recall that any update on our side was able to affect the BER value itself.

[el bandido]

The 03-10-2015 driver loaded automatically when I turned on my receiver today. One of the stations 10.1 which I was having glitch problems with in my earlier posts, seems to have improved. The BER is much lower for some reason, even though I have not touched the antenna position, nor made any other changes.

The search loop is still acting the same. But I am happy that the BER has dropped..... makes a big difference in the glitching department.

What frequency are you using? It is displaying 194MHz, Maybe try scanning that channel using 195.000 MHz and see if it is better/worse.

[eastof111]

Just rescanned, BER fluctuates about the same range.

[mb1]

I finally got a tracking number for my order today, my order is shipping from Denmark, I tough this company is in Germany, did your orders shipped from Germany?
Regards.
Chewie

How long takes to get tracking number Chewie

[Sundtek]

At the moment quick we have 5 units in stock ready for shipping and 10 more could be restocked (needs finalizing the assembly) before we have to manufacture new PCBs.
The volume is very small and it's still under development for settopboxes.
The tuners and settopbox software have some nice features, eg the networking support you should try that one :-)

[chewie]

How long takes to get tracking number Chewie

Hello mb1, it took about 7 days, they claim it just shipped on the 9 of this month, so is not in the US yet.

[el bandido]

I just reordered another one because I never got an answer about the first order placed on March 3. Now my account shows two active orders. It has been explained that there were some problems, so we will see if they have been worked out. I think it is a good device, or else I would not fool with trying to get another one.

[el bandido]

Just received and invoice and paid. I will let you know when I get tracking#.

The last driver update seemed to fix some of the channel crashes, but now there is a new problem. The driver seems to quit working on channels that have a very weak signal. When the driver quits working, the channels will show a signal strength but will have a black screen.
Rebooting Enigma2 will not reset the black screen. You have to reboot Dreambox (hard reboot) in order to clear the black screen.

This new driver will also lock the receiver up when scanning if a group of frequencies is scanned containing strong channels and marginal or weak channels.
I have 15 transponders that contain tv channels entered into the terrestrial file and named this frequency group Atlanta, Ga. Scanning this group will lock the receiver, causing the spinner to become active and stay active. This happens when a weak mux is being scanned.

On the plus side, this new driver appears to have been worked on in the channel naming department. More muxes are being named correctly providing the signal is strong, and only the big muxes are not being named. So the new driver gets a plus in the channel naming department and the receiver lock-ups, but gets a minus in causing a black screen on weak channels or channels with a high BER. The black screen issue Does Not seem to happen on channels without any signal.

Channels without any signal cause the spinner to become active, and then not active for a second or so, then the spinner is active again. It is frustrating trying to move through two or three channels with no signal. You have to wait for the spinner to stop, press the remote button, then spend more time waiting. This problem compounds when stepping through several channels with no signal.

[mb1]

Well is 11 days past no respond here .I made payment using pay pall direct to Sundtek everything when well money where received he told me .After that i never heard from him

[el bandido]

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Send an email to the above address and ask them what happened. Be sure to include your order number. I can understand anybody being out of stock, but I cannot understand Not Communicating, especially after somebody has paid.

[mb1]

Done that 2 days a go still no respond

[chewie]

Done that 2 days a go still no respond
Hello mb1
I had to send them 3 e-mails before they responded, keep sending the e-mails.
Regards.
Chewie

[eastof111]

Done that 2 days a go still no respond

Had the same problems as I posted earlier. Hang in there mb1, it will be worth it once you receive yours.

[el bandido]

Attached is a revised terrestrial file that was used to get the 70 channel scan. For set topbox use, This file should be unzipped, then installed in etc/tuxbox

I have spent lot of time playing with the center frequency, but I keep coming back closer to what we originally started with. I find the tv signal to be about 1 MHz wide, so you can move the center frequency about 500-550KHz either side of the dead center frequency and still get tv channels. I conclude that moving more than a few KHz from center frequency can cause scanning problems such as loss of channel name.

[el bandido]

I have received confirmation that my second device has been shipped, and expect that the shipping problem for everyone else here has been resolved. We should all be getting our devices soon.

We have dealt with several new products at this forum, and I have dealt with a few on my on. Most of the time with a new product, my money is taken very quickly, and the new product may/may not arrive quickly, and the new product almost always has little or no support. Sundtek was the reverse of this, providing excellent product support, but having issues in product distribution instead. Hopefully these distribution problems have been resolved.

EPG is being looked at and will probably be next.
What kind of EPG do you get on your tv, and how many days will it extend? It would help to have an answer on this, even if you do not have a device. Just take a few minutes and look at your tv and tell me how far or how many days the EPG extends....Canada and U.S.

[Sundtek]

It seems like the channel we captured back then has 2 days of EPG


[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Do you really have a channel which is playing weather information for 12 hours?
EPG START TIME: Sun 2015-02-22 22:00:00 CET
EPG length: 12:00:00 (43200)
EPG (eng): 11Alive Weather
EPG
EPG START TIME: Sun 2015-02-22 22:00:00 CET
EPG length: 12:00:00 (43200)
EPG (eng): 11Alive Weather


EPG START TIME: Sun 2015-02-22 21:00:00 CET
EPG length: 03:00:00 (10800)
EPG (eng): NHL Hockey
Hockey 3 hours?


Now that needs to be reassembled to DVB-T EPG

I'm not sure how long the entire procedure will take

[el bandido]

Yes. One channel in that mux is weather for most of the day. You may need to do another capture, then compare it to the published EPG listings that are available on the Internet. The information you are seeing may make more sense when compared to published information.

Both of my televisions only show Now and Next EPG, so having a two day EPG would be much better than what my tv can do.

[eastof111]

Two days sounds fine. In my case if I need to check a week ahead, I just use my DirecTV local channels guide which is more comprehensive than my older one day tv guide. Then there are the on line tv guides which one can use. But if later available, more than two days would be very nice too.

[Sundtek]

They are working on ATSC 3.0 for US already let's see what that will bring, I'm sure we'll be one of the first ones engineering devices for that.
Currently ATSC 2.0 is available in US/CA.

[Only registered and activated users can see links] SC_3.0

ATSC 3.0 will even be slower available for settopboxes than ATSC 2.0. It might be good for us that we will have a working DVB-T translation layer inside the driver so even for settopboxes we should be able to support that quickly in the future.

[el bandido]

Why can't we be like the rest of the Modern world? IMO, we should have changed to DVB-T during the digital transition. And we keep the English measuring system when metric system is better and easier to learn....

Anyway. We agreed to look at EPG, but it is stormy here and the 3-10 driver is giving problems with black channels. I have to hard boot to get out of it. I keep reloading older images to get the 3-1-2015 driver which I think works best. The only advantage I see using the 3-10-2015 driver is some channel muxes scan names better. Where do the drivers reside in the E2 image or what is an easy way to roll back to the 3-1-2015 driver besides reloading a backup image?

11118

[Sundtek]

Can you set up teamviewer again?

[el bandido]

Cannot setup Team Viewer at the moment because it is too late. It will be available this weekend...

But it looks like the problem was the center frequency. I revised the list and set it back to all zeros except for MHz. It looks like the modifications that you made to the driver also made the center frequency more critical.

I am finished playing with the center frequency as a file. I may try changing a single mux a bit in the future using the receiver, but what is attached will be what I use as an ATSC file from now on.

I will add more transponders to the Atlanta slot as I move in other directions and scan new transponders. Other than that, the attached file will not be changed.

I feel comfortable that you can commit the main file or even the whole attached file to OpenPLi and other E2 image devs. We should not need to alter or change anything else unless we find some missing transponders to add.

I have a 300 MB video that runs for about 20 minutes, demonstrating scanning and the found channels. This video was made a short time ago in bad weather, and the 3-10-2015 driver did excellent after the channels were scanned with the correct center frequency. I will look at splitting that 300 MB video and uploading it here.

[el bandido]

Spoke too soon.

The problem is still there with the 3-10-2015 driver. Rolling back to 3-1-2015 driver does not have this issue. Short video attached.

[Sundtek]

Spoke too soon.

The problem is still there with the 3-10-2015 driver. Rolling back to 3-1-2015 driver does not have this issue. Short video attached.


The big channels cause a buffer overflow in the DVB-T table re-assembly engine.

The rewriting engine is always active so once you jump onto such frequency it will damage the driver session at the moment.

As mentioned in the first version we only expect that there are just a few stations transmitted per transponder.

Many channels need to slice the information into several packets, that is not implemented at the moment. The maximum size of a packet is around 188 bytes.

I think that EPG support will have the same issue, so the slicer will be implemented I guess it will be implemented during the ATSC EPG to DVB EPG re-assembly.

So for now try to avoid accessing the big channels after a fresh reboot.

[el bandido]

Everything seems to run fine using the 3-10 driver in good weather. The problem(s) seem to only exist in bad weather when the signal is low and unstable. It may help to have the SNR displayed in db to give a better idea of how strong the reception is.

[eastof111]

Still getting glitching on strong signal and BER 0 channel using 03-10-15 driver.

[eastof111]

The channel I was having problems with earlier does not glitch now with a BER of 40 and a lower signal strength.

[el bandido]

Did you reboot the box or did it clear up on its own?

[Sundtek]

if the BER is 0 and the problem is reproducible we might need a sample stream to doublecheck that we are not damaging the stream due binary patching it.

[el bandido]

3-10 Driver seems to be more particular about the frequency being correct, or maybe it has been that way all along and I have not noticed? At any rate, it would probably be a good idea to delete all terrestrial channels and rescan after installing the file in post#183.

It would be nice to know if your Sundtek device scans the same amount of channels as your tv using the file in post#183.

[eastof111]

if the BER is 0 and the problem is reproducible we might need a sample stream to doublecheck that we are not damaging the stream due binary patching it.

Make a short recording and post it here?

[eastof111]

Ok will try the file in post #183 and see what happens.

[eastof111]

Loaded and scanned and it froze at 25% completed, 527 mhz. Going back to older file and rescan and see what happens.

[eastof111]

Reloaded prior xml file that was working before and it also froze at 25%, 527.3 mhz. Upgraded ATV to the latest build last night. Could be a bug in the new build. Going back to NFR that I know was working and give it another try.

[el bandido]

Nope. IMO, That 3-10-2015 driver is doing that. Same thing happened to me and rolling back to the 3-1-2015 solved the issue.

[eastof111]

Where's the 3-1?

[el bandido]

Good question. I have a back-up image with it installed that I can upload if you want it. I do not know exactly where the Sundtek drivers reside in the image or I would post them instead.

[eastof111]

What's weird is that some times it will display a quick tune failed message and most other times it will go in to the search loop and take a very long time to exit.

[el bandido]

I have had that happen too. Is the weather bad or is it raining per chance?

[eastof111]

No rain, just some scattered clouds, even though the weather service says is cloudy.

[Persian Prince]

i will add sundtek plugin to PE (pre-installed by default) for future releases as an american feature ;) but maybe with some changes because i need to see the codes

anyway is there something that i can do like kernel modding or something ?

it's good to be back and see you're still developing something :)

[el bandido]

Excellent to see you my friend! Looking forward to the next Perisan Empire image!

[el bandido]

March 15, 2015 , 7:23 pm Processed Through Sort Facility ISC NEW YORK NY(USPS)

My second device should be here by Friday, depending on what U.S. customs does.

Everybody that ordered one of these should have a working tracking number.

[chewie]

Mind Departed Nashua N.H, I hope is coming my way, My Miraclebox still lost out there or in someone leaving room, I will give them to the end of this month if they can find it or send me I new one, I will contact PayPal.
Regards.
Chewie

[el bandido]

It might be a good idea to open a PayPal complaint now. Doing that may make the receiver appear.

Be prepared to sign for the Sundtek device. I had to sign for the last one.

[el bandido]

Putty RS232 Log attached showing crash during scanning. Log name is listed as blindscan, but we know blindscan does not exist for ATSC

[eastof111]

I usually shut off everything before I go to bed and I just booted my Vu+ and as usual it will not display certain channels. Switched over to my TV and they all display fine. Tried hitting the blue button (start tuner) which sometimes will rectify the problem. Other times it I have to hit the yellow button (restart) and again will rectify the problem. Tonight, absolutely no go. Only certain channels will display.

[mb1]

Sundtek why don't you respond when people send you email ??

[chewie]

got my Sundtek today, yeahhhhhhhhhh

[el bandido]

Plug it in the Duo2 and run it!

Looks like it is going to take a Miracle to get the Miracle Box that you ordered.

[chewie]

you got that right EB, the seller is telling me they shipped a new box and provided a tracking number, I talked to PayPal to let them know that the seller is sending a new box and gave them the new tracking number, according to PayPal the new tracking number is no good, so they send a e-mail to the seller to confirm the new tracking number and they have 3 days to respond, if not, they going to give my money back, is getting messy.
This is the seller I purchased the VU, well I hope everything works out.
I have route a new cable from my antenna to my VU, most likely I work on it this weekend if no rain.
Regards.
Chewie

[el bandido]

I Would like to know who or what company the Miraclebox was ordered from so they can be avoided in the future.

I have found where some older Sundtek drivers have been stored and will upload them here if needed, but I expect us to have a new driver before the weekend is over.
The Sundtek plugin does have an option to store drivers to the hard drive (or other designated drive) and reload these drivers as desired. It would be a good idea to store the old driver first before loading a new one.

The glitching on channels where the signal is high and the BER is 0 has been added to the bug list, but there are issues in solving the epg that may/may not solve the glitching at the same time. You can expect to see work in the epg area next, and then hopefully fix the glitching after the epg is solved IF it still exists at that point.

There has been an exception in my shipping so my second Sundtek device will be here Saturday. Looking forward to seeing how the Duo2 and Zero handle two of these devices at the same time.

[Sundtek]

Sundtek why don't you respond when people send you email ??

hmm which email? Please send it again...

[Sundtek]

It might be a good idea to open a PayPal complaint now. Doing that may make the receiver appear.

Be prepared to sign for the Sundtek device. I had to sign for the last one.

The units are shipped as registered mail there's also some insurance on it in case it gets lost. Packages outside of Germany all have to be signed. However the receiver is another item not from us not sure how they ship their stuff.

[el bandido]

3-20 Driver is now available. Have not tested it yet.

[Sundtek]

Zapping should be a little bit quicker there was a delay of 0.3 seconds inside which should only apply to PC systems but not to settopboxes; While this did not affect Dreamboxes it affected all the other boxes. Some EPG stuff has been added but it's not enabled yet for ATSC we're on a good way with it but it will still take time it all requires deep knowledge of the American and European digital TV standard.

[eastof111]

Loaded 3-20 and rebooted, did a new scan and it freezes at 25%. Can't get a screen shot because it is trying to connect.

[el bandido]

Zapping is smooth, and may be a bit faster, but zapping is as good or better than the speed and smoothness of the satellite channels unless the signals are being degraded by bad weather.
Still having problems in bad or rainy weather with extremely slow channel changes when the signal is be degraded in a major way. Even moving the antenna can present problems because channels with no signal seems to put the device in a position where it does not know what to do. The receiver's spinner becomes active and channel changes have to be timed in muxes that have lost their signal due to weather or due to the antenna being moved.

Overall the 3-20 driver is an improvement and seems to be very stable in good weather. Zapping is extremely smooth, even when a different transponder is being selected during the channel change.

[el bandido]

/media/hdd/backup/SundtekBackup

Attached are my stored drivers. I found them in the Hard Drive address listed above. You may want to try them and see if the problem exists in other driver dates. The driver dated 1969 is 3-9 driver, and I think 3-1 driver is in there too.

I have had a couple hang-ups when scanning, and found that doing a Network Search caused my receiver to hang. So I think Network Search should be set to No.

[eastof111]

With 3-20 I turned off network scan and it still froze.

[Sundtek]

eastof111, can you just contact us via Skype (sundtek) I guess this is just related to big channels and it's on the todolist already.
Big channels are more challenging since we have to create and inject multiple DVB-T packets

[el bandido]

Big channels meaning a transponder or frequency that contains 5 or more sub channels?

I could say that most of my hang ups or freezes have happened when going to or coming from a big channel frequency. As a test later today or when it rains again, I will try to remove the big channel frequencies and see how it runs without them.

[chewie]

Hello Guys
I set mine up and is not working real good, it only scans 18 channels and can not see any thing, I uploaded the .xml files you guys posted here, the scanning is very slow.
I am using ATV image and it does recognize the tuner, I am not sure if is set up properly, can you guys tell me how yours is set up, tuner config, plugin and the manual scan.
Thanks in advance
Chewie

[eastof111]

Chewie, here are pixs of my setup that allows me to receive 54 channels, although I still have some glitching problems with reception on some channels. I am on ATV on a usb stick also. Scanning does take some time.

The Control Center was installed via the plugin available on line which made setting it up very easy.

[el bandido]

The difference between RG6 and RG11 in terrestrial tv installations is very noticeable. I gained 15-20 SNR points today simply by upgrading the RG6 to RG11 on the lower UHF antenna. The antenna was also moved up about 4-5 meters which probably helped a bit with the SNR increase.

RG11 helps in satellite installations too, but it is not as noticeable, and changing from RG6 to RG11 for a satellite run will probably not help much. The satellite lnb has a pre-amp or line amp included in the lnb. This amp is band specific, and can be over 40db in strength.
Terrestrial antennas can also have a pre-amp or line amp, but these amps are designed to cover several frequency bands, and cannot normally be as effective as the lnb amp. Terrestrial amps are usually less than 20 db

It would not surprise me to see a SNR of 140-150 on the strong frequencies when I change the top antenna to RG11. Hopefully this scale can be adjusted after more important things are fixed, but even the tv is reading a 97 percent signal on some of these channels.

[el bandido]

Hello Guys
I set mine up and is not working real good, it only scans 18 channels and can not see any thing, I uploaded the .xml files you guys posted here, the scanning is very slow.
I am using ATV image and it does recognize the tuner, I am not sure if is set up properly, can you guys tell me how yours is set up, tuner config, plugin and the manual scan.
Thanks in advance
Chewie

I suggest only using manual scan. See attached pictures.

[chewie]

Hello Guys
I installed the opendroid image, and installed the tuner plugin, and the .xml file to etc/tuxbox, i have the same settings you guys have, the tuner is connected to the USB in the back of the box, does it make a difference which USB is connected to?
Scan, and the same thing 18 channels, but no display or sound.
Any ideas?
Please let me know.
Chewie

[el bandido]

The Sundtek usb can be connected to any usb port, but I would not suggest using a hub.
How many channels do you normally get with the tv? Have you checked and verified that the antenna cable you have connected to the Sundtek usb works by connecting a television to it?

I will be glad to upload the image I am using if you would like to try it and see if it helps.

[chewie]

Hello EB
I try verifying with a T.V last night I get like 101 channels, so the cable and antenna are working, I did put a splitter and have 2 TV connected to it, i wonder if is compatible with this tuner, I will try to bypass the splitter and see what happens.
Yes upload your image, If nothing works I'll give it try.
Question, do I have to build a .XML list for my area?
Thanks for all the help.
Regards.
Chewie

[el bandido]

I was expecting over 100 channels for your area. No, you do not have to build a .XML for your area, but it would be nice if you did after you get it running. Having a custom .XML file for your area saves time when scanning, and not much of anything else. The big transponders, or the frequencies that contain 10-20 channels give this system a fit because it was not designed for that. I am making a backup image for you now and it should be here for you to download within the hour.

It is raining here again so I decided to look at the channel issues. Sundtek has said several times that the big channels or frequencies with many channels are causing problems in this system. I let the receiver scan, then deleted the frequencies that were hanging. What followed was pretty predictable.

The 3-20 driver works fine in the rain with the large frequencies deleted. Channel names were scanned, and everything worked as could be expected in the rain.
I made a sub-set in the terrestrial file for Atlanta that contains the 4 problem frequencies. I tried scanning this sub-set as a group, and then tried rescanning them one by one. I found that the 20 channel 563 MHz frequency causes problems for other frequencies when it is added. Scanning 563 MHz by itself causes other muxes with 5 channels or more to lose channels. The lost channels are still in the receiver, but will not display a signal. Rescanning the frequencies that lost channels will usually restore the missing channels, but then you lose channels in the 563 MHz mux.
So after all is said and done, the larger muxes are where a lot of the problems are located. Sundtek has said this several times, but I had not segregated the problem frequencies until last night. Attached is modified .XML in case Sundtek wants to note the problem frequencies.

[chewie]

Thanks EB, I'll try this list as well. I post the findings.
Regards.
Chewie

[el bandido]

Backup image attached

[el bandido]

Using the 3-20 driver, the found channels should have names assigned to them. Any transponder or frequency that has over 5 channels on it should be deleted and not scanned. If the 18 channels that you scanned are displaying channel frequencies instead of channel names, then delete that frequency from the scan list, delete the found channels from the receiver, and try again.

More than likely, any scanned frequency that displays the channel frequency instead of the channel name should be deleted unless the mux is 5 channels or less.

[el bandido]

Short video attached showing 30 channel scan and channel changes between different frequencies.

[chewie]

Hello EB
Thanks for the video, I bypass the splitter and I was able to scan 49 channels, my scan is not as fast as yours, and some of the HD channels the picture kind of freezes up and than you can watch any thing, I had to restart and everything was fine until you hit another HD that is freezing up, not all HD freeze up, channels look pretty good.
Regarding my Splitter, do you know any that will connect 2 TV to one antenna for UHF/VHF, if you guys have any suggestions, please let me know.
Thanks for the help.
Regards.
Chewie

[el bandido]

Progress!!!!

Home Depot sells splitters. You need one designed for tv.

Also, make note of any frequency that has more than 5 channels on it. Delete the frequency from your scan, and then delete the channels. Any frequency that has more than 5 channels may corrupt the device. This is a work-around until Sundtek fixes it.

[eastof111]

The cox cable guy gave me a splitter a few years ago when he installed my internet. Industrial sealed grade and low loss and perfect for uhf/vhf compared to the Chinese stuff out there that claim 3.0 db loss per output.

[chewie]

here are some of the pictures:

[eastof111]

Very nice, Chewie.

[el bandido]

Frequency 617MHz or 617000 needs to be deleted and all the channels for that frequency needs to be removed. Leaving the 617MHz channels in there will cause corruption and driver problems. Any other frequency that has over 5 channels should be removed.

[el bandido]

Had messy, rainy weather all weekend so it was a good time to test for hang-ups or black screens that would need a hard boot to correct. Attached are some pictures of a channel that does not come in well at all in bad weather because of its location. This channel used to cause the receiver to lock up or have to be hard booted because of a black screen. i let the receiver sit on this channel for several hours without any issues.

Overall performance has increased considerably since deleting the Big Channels. The glitching problem has improved to the point that it is probably equal to the regular television, and signal sensitivity has increased. The Sundtek Device has been moved to another room where everybody can use it. Still waiting on device#2 due to the slow USPS.

112171121811219

[Sundtek]

The next version will support bigger transponders for example:

0x0000 0x0003: pmt_pid 0x0030 Sundtek -- ION (14.1) (running)
0x0000 0x0004: pmt_pid 0x0040 Sundtek -- qubo (14.2) (running)
0x0000 0x0005: pmt_pid 0x0050 Sundtek -- IONLife (14.3) (running)
0x0000 0x0006: pmt_pid 0x0060 Sundtek -- Shop (14.4) (running)
0x0000 0x0007: pmt_pid 0x0070 Sundtek -- QVC (14.5) (running)
0x0000 0x0009: pmt_pid 0x0090 Sundtek -- TLMD (47.1) (running)
0x0000 0x005a: pmt_pid 0x0290 Sundtek -- Starz (14.90) (running)
0x0000 0x005f: pmt_pid 0x02a9 Sundtek -- Shotime (14.95) (running)
0x0000 0x0060: pmt_pid 0x02ae Sundtek -- Airbox (14.96) (running)

previously a transponder like that one just dropped the channel names completely.

[eastof111]

Looking forward to the next version. :bigthumbup:

[Sundtek]

The update is online.

The only change to the previous driver is the support for the transponder which we got with the bigger channel names.
If there's still an issue with such channels let me know.

[eastof111]

Great progress.... loaded 3-23 and it scanned much faster and all channels had names!

[eastof111]

Forgot to say that zapping is much, much faster too.

[el bandido]

The problem with the big channel muxes is still there, but the info needed to fix them is being transferred.

[chewie]

Updated mine to the new version, zapping is much faster and also scan, I only scan 48 yesterday but this new version picked up 109 channels yeahhhhhhhhhhhhh, I am testing them now.
Regards.
Chewie

[el bandido]

If possible, Please delete all channels, including the satellite channels and do a scan of 109 channels. Then go to etc/enigma2 of the box and upload the lamedb file here. You will need to zip the file first.

[Sundtek]

Your problem on those 2 transponder frequencies is different, it has nothing to do with the big channel names.

The transponder data is incomplete, not completely filled out by the operator who runs those ATSC transponders.
Unfortunately Enigma2 seems to rely on that particular information which is set to 0 and it finally will end up bundling the scanned results to the wrong frequency.

2 dumps are uploading to us, so we will have a look at it within the next days.

[chewie]

well. I look at all channels and no freezing up, zapping is very good, got more than a few HD channels,I might need you help with this " upload the lamedb file" I use Dogsettings to delete channels I don't know what you use, but I have to delete one by one.
I will give a shot.
Regards.
Chewie

[el bandido]

Just upload the lamedb file with the 109 terrestrial channels and do not worry about deleting anything. You may use FileZilla to get the lamedb file out of the receiver. It is located in etc/enigma2. Thanks.

[eastof111]

Is there any way of keeping the driver updates from always overwriting the currently installed terrestrial.xml?